tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post1065105357322731101..comments2016-08-15T08:37:59.885-04:00Comments on Uncommon Dissent: We Must Not Pull Up the TaresBenjaminhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08834054311958455399noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-23009836275113436922015-11-13T22:25:32.975-05:002015-11-13T22:25:32.975-05:00He might have addressed them both together as equa...He might have addressed them both together as equals. He could have saved himself saying six extra words. :)<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06823274358649280669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-8010173541867886232015-03-09T15:43:37.006-04:002015-03-09T15:43:37.006-04:00I wasn't trying to find fault. What I wasn...I wasn't trying to find fault. What I wasn't clear on was what the sealer's speech had to do with what you were taught. Sexism is a "different" view, but that doesn't mean it creates beauty. I think the lesson you were trying to teach is that tares serve a purpose. I'm not sure that means you should leave them in place. I think there's a mixed metaphor problem here, but I haven't figure it out fully yet.<br /> George Huanghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17171856499196606927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-35187916654649435432015-03-09T15:38:32.105-04:002015-03-09T15:38:32.105-04:00This makes plenty of sense to me. Except you only...This makes plenty of sense to me. Except you only gave the wife four words! :) Sometimes I am not sure whether feminism permits recognition of differences in gender or not.George Huanghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17171856499196606927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-27075510155874305002015-03-09T12:34:09.174-04:002015-03-09T12:34:09.174-04:00That temple sealer should not have been up there t...That temple sealer should not have been up there talking for ten minutes. The ceremony is about the couple, not the "sagely" wisdom. As an Army Chaplain I have had the opportunity to officiate weddings. I keep my comments to five minutes or less. The focus is that it is the couple's wonderful day. No one remembers what the officiator said.<br /><br />I agree with you Ben, that the interpretation of Tares being lost from the beginning is wrong. It sounds very Calvinist, which over the past 40 years has slowly died out. Our recent lesson in Sunday School and Priesthood on repentance shows that a mighty change of heart can change the eternal destiny of a person.<br /><br />As always, love your blog. Great food for thought.Ryanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02826582658529335419noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-8922360027830226472015-03-09T11:24:14.439-04:002015-03-09T11:24:14.439-04:00I would have thought it odd had the situation been...I would have thought it odd had the situation been reversed: ten minutes to the wife, and six words to the husband, and I think I would have still been upset about it. (I wasn't at this sealing, for the record, so what I know is only secondhand as well.) I absolutely would not have been upset at all if the two had been given completely different counsel to the two separate parties. In fact, that's what I would expect and hope for. Each has different things to contribute to the marriage, so each needs separate counsel. At the very least, they could have both been given the same counsel, but they should have been addressed together, instead of talking to the husband and then saying, "Oh yeah, you too."Janellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10851454323588239492noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-76181598702344048332015-03-09T11:14:51.542-04:002015-03-09T11:14:51.542-04:00George, it was just plain old sexism--no need to a...George, it was just plain old sexism--no need to address the wife because the husband is where the buck stops. I don't think that the sealer intended any sexism. Let's face it, the guy was old and was brought up in a different era. If I had to put money on it, I bet he had no idea what he did was sexist. Like you, I agree that he was trying to build the kingdom. So perhaps I didn't stress it enough, but we each have a responsibility to try to understand where the other is coming from. We each also have the simultaneous responsibility to try and be a little more sensitive to where the other is coming from. <br /><br />In other words, my lividness was contributing to the problem. Getting infuriated over the message fails to acknowledge and celebrate the diversity of thought. Sure, I can think it's wrong to deliver those kinds of messages, but I need to communicate that in ways that don't humiliate or attack the speaker. In that aspect, I failed my own message (and frequently fail even now).Benjaminhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08834054311958455399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-64001844486330524022015-03-09T09:33:58.821-04:002015-03-09T09:33:58.821-04:00Perhaps there was context in the sealing ceremony ...Perhaps there was context in the sealing ceremony I am missing. After reading your description, I got the impression she got the six words because the sealer didn't want to repeat everything again for 10 more minutes and someone had to be second. I did not get the impression it was because she was "the wife". Would you have been livid if the sealer had spoken to her for the 10 minutes, then given the six words to the groom? Would you have been livid if the sealer had given her different counsel instead? I think the sealer's intent was to build up a little bit of the kingdom, and not to be divisive and hurtful. How would you have done it if you were the sealer? The only thing I remember about my own sealing was the enormous smile on the face of my wife's best friend.George Huanghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17171856499196606927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2257730030776318662.post-62992643401820978272015-03-09T08:00:41.743-04:002015-03-09T08:00:41.743-04:00I am upset about the six words. Great talk Ben. ...I am upset about the six words. Great talk Ben. Very insightful.Kirk Harringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01167071025594023526noreply@blogger.com